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2 votes
1 answers
274 views
Does Reformed Theology teach that Old Testament saints were personally united to Christ?
Union with Christ is a central doctrine in Reformed Theology, and concerns the mystical union of the believer with Christ, by faith and by the Holy Spirit. In faith the Spirit unites us to Christ, and that union is the means by which Christ's saving work is applied to us, it is the power of regenera...
Union with Christ is a central doctrine in Reformed Theology, and concerns the mystical union of the believer with Christ, by faith and by the Holy Spirit. In faith the Spirit unites us to Christ, and that union is the means by which Christ's saving work is applied to us, it is the power of regeneration, and the basis on which the earthly church can and should be united. While there may be a sense in which all of the elect are united to Christ even before they come to faith, this Union is normally spoken about in reference to our temporal experience of God's grace: the unbelieving elect person is not yet united to Christ, but instead we are united to Christ when we are given new life, the power to have faith, and freed from sin, or in other words, saved. (Though there is a logical order, the *ordo salutis*, from our perspective we experience these things concurrently.) So here we come to my question: Does Reformed Theology teach that the Old Testament saints were personally united to Christ in this same way? Reformed theologians have traditionally taught Covenant Theology, where the various Biblical covenants, including the Old (Mosaic) and the New, are seen as aspects of the one eternal Covenant of Grace. So the Westminster Confession says: > WCF 7.6: Under the gospel, when Christ the substance was exhibited, the ordinances in which this covenant is dispensed, are the preaching of the Word, and the administration of the sacraments of Baptism and the Lord's Supper; which, though fewer in number, and administered with more simplicity and less outward glory, yet in them it is held forth in more fullness, evidence, and spiritual efficacy, to all nations, both Jews and Gentiles; and is called the New Testament. **There are not, therefore, two covenants of grace differing in substance, but one and the same under various dispensations.** > > WCF 8.6: Although the work of redemption was not actually wrought by Christ till after his incarnation, yet **the virtue, efficacy, and benefits thereof were communicated into the elect, in all ages successively from the beginning of the world**, in and by those promises, types, and sacrifices wherein he was revealed, and signified to be the seed of the woman, which should bruise the serpent's head, and the Lamb slain from the beginning of the world, being yesterday and today the same and for ever. These paragraphs would seem to indicate that yes, the OT saints were united to Christ in the same way as NT Christians are. But it's not explicit, and there are some factors which would argue against it. First is that at Pentecost there seems to have been a fundamental change of state for the disciples whom the Holy Spirit came upon. Before that moment Jesus's disciples had faith, and the faith of the Christian is the same faith as that of Abraham (Romans 4:16). But the indwelling presence of the Spirit seems like something new; indeed Peter in Acts 2:16-21 says that the Spirit's coming upon them is the fulfilment of Joel 2:28-32, this "pouring out" of the Spirit being something new from the perspective of the OT prophets. When Paul describes the blessings of Israel in Romans 9:4-5 the Spirit is not one of them. A second factor is that the NT consistently describes the Spirit's indwelling as permanent. Several verses describe the Spirit as our guarantee of the rest of God's blessings (2 Cor 1:22, 2 Cor 5:5, Eph 1:13-14). In contrast the OT often speaks of the Spirit departing from someone or being taken from them (Judges 16:20, 1 Sam 16:14, Ps 51:11, Is 59:21), and many times when the Spirit comes to someone (Judges 3:10, 6:34, Ezek 2:2), it comes to someone we would most naturally describe as already having faith. Now there are many ways those verses are understood, but I've often heard it said (though not necessarily by Reformed teachers) that the indwelling of saints in the OT was only temporary, instead of the permanent indwelling Christians receive. So how does Reformed Theology understand the role of the Holy Spirit in the life of the Old Testament believer, and whether those believers should best be described as being personally united to Christ? ---------------- It is conceivable that Reformed Baptists may have a different answer to Reformed Paedobaptists as many of them reject Covenant Theology and would not say that there was only one covenant that applied equally to Old and New Testament saints. If this is the case, a good answer would explain the position of both Reformed Baptists and Paedobaptists.
curiousdannii (22772 rep)
Mar 31, 2020, 02:43 AM • Last activity: Feb 1, 2026, 02:30 PM
3 votes
2 answers
258 views
What is an overview of beliefs about how the Holy Spirit guides Christians?
How are Christians led by the Holy Spirit? How does the Holy Spirit communicate God's will to Christians? What mechanisms does the Holy Spirit employ to this end? Since these are probably controversial questions, I'm interested in an overview of major perspectives and what groups hold each perspecti...
How are Christians led by the Holy Spirit? How does the Holy Spirit communicate God's will to Christians? What mechanisms does the Holy Spirit employ to this end? Since these are probably controversial questions, I'm interested in an overview of major perspectives and what groups hold each perspective. ___ **Appendix - NT passages about the lead of the Holy Spirit** > *For **all who are led by the Spirit of God** are sons of God.* (Romans 8:14 ESV) > *And Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan **and was led by the Spirit in the wilderness***. (Luke 4:1 ESV) > ***My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me**.* (John 10:27 ESV) > *When the **Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth**, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come.* (John 16:13 ESV) > *But **the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you**.* (John 14:26 ESV) > *Then **the Spirit said to Philip**, “Go up and join this chariot.”* (Acts 8:29 ESV) > *While Peter was reflecting on the vision, **the Spirit said to him**, “Behold, three men are looking for you. But get up, go downstairs and accompany them without misgivings, for I have sent them Myself.”* (Acts 10:19-20 ESV) > ***The Spirit told me** to go with them without misgivings. These six brethren also went with me and we entered the man’s house.​* (Acts 11:12 ESV) > *While they were ministering to the Lord and fasting, **the Holy Spirit said**, “Set apart for Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.”* (Acts 13:2 ESV) > *6 And they went through the region of Phrygia and Galatia, **having been forbidden by the Holy Spirit** to speak the word in Asia. 7 And when they had come up to Mysia, they attempted to go into Bithynia, **but the Spirit of Jesus did not allow them**. 8 So, passing by Mysia, they went down to Troas. 9 **And a vision appeared to Paul in the night**: a man of Macedonia was standing there, urging him and saying, “Come over to Macedonia and help us.” 10 **And when Paul had seen the vision**, immediately we sought to go on into Macedonia, concluding that **God had called us** to preach the gospel to them.* (Acts 16:6-10 ESV) > *9 He had four unmarried daughters, who prophesied. 10 While we were staying for many days, a prophet named Agabus came down from Judea. 11 And coming to us, he took Paul's belt and bound his own feet and hands and said, “**Thus says the Holy Spirit**, ‘This is how the Jews at Jerusalem will bind the man who owns this belt and deliver him into the hands of the Gentiles.’”* (Acts 21:9-11 ESV)
user50422
Apr 26, 2022, 06:32 PM • Last activity: Jan 24, 2026, 01:08 AM
2 votes
1 answers
99 views
What is the difference between "outpouring of the Holy Spirit" and "filling of the Holy Spirit"?
Here is an example of a context with **"outpouring of the Holy Spirit"** (phrase in bold): > #### Bill McLeod > > Wilbert “Bill” Laing McLeod (1919 - 2012). Canadian Baptist pastor and revivalist born in Winnipeg, Manitoba. Converted at 22 in 1941, he left a sales career to enter ministry, studying...
Here is an example of a context with **"outpouring of the Holy Spirit"** (phrase in bold): > #### Bill McLeod > > Wilbert “Bill” Laing McLeod (1919 - 2012). Canadian Baptist pastor and revivalist born in Winnipeg, Manitoba. Converted at 22 in 1941, he left a sales career to enter ministry, studying at Manitoba Baptist Bible Institute. Ordained in 1946, he pastored in Rosthern, Saskatchewan, and served as a circuit preacher in Strathclair, Shoal Lake, and Birtle. From 1962 to 1981, he led Ebenezer Baptist Church in Saskatoon, growing it from 175 to over 1,000 members. Central to the 1971 Canadian Revival, sparked by the Sutera Twins’ crusade, his emphasis on prayer and repentance drew thousands across denominations, lasting seven weeks. McLeod authored When Revival Came to Canada and recorded numerous sermons, praised by figures like Paul Washer. Married to Barbara Robinson for over 70 years, they had five children: Judith, Lois, Joanna, Timothy, and Naomi. His ministry, focused on scriptural fidelity and revival, impacted Canada and beyond through radio and conferences. > > #### Sermon Summary > > In this sermon, the speaker shares a powerful testimony of a meeting where the glory of God was experienced. It started with one person praying and soon others joined, resulting in a powerful **outpouring of the Holy Spirit**. The meeting lasted for over four hours, with people confessing their sins and seeking God's presence. The speaker emphasizes the need for the glory of God to return to our churches and lives, and encourages repentance, prayer, faith, and identification with Christ as the simple yet costly price to pay for experiencing God's glory. > > https://www.sermonindex.net/sermons/XuEeri0s1gBZfmHq Here is an example of a context with **"filling of the Holy Spirit"** (phrase in bold): >#### God's Word Enhances the Work of the Spirit > >A beam of light doesn't have to shine down on my house for the Spirit to fill me. I don't have to jump three times and turn in circles or say the right thing or have the name John to know the power of the Holy Spirit. I simply need to pray, seek to align my heart with God’s, and fill my mind with His Word. > >It isn't complicated, but that doesn’t mean it’s effortless: a daily **filling of the Holy Spirit** requires a daily filling of the Word of God. In contrast, I firmly believe a lack of Spirit-filled living is due to a lack of enthusiasm for the Bible, along with mediocre attempts to fight sin. But if God's Word is filling us, then the Spirit of God will too. > > https://www.reviveourhearts.com/blog/what-does-it-mean-to-be-filled-with-the-spirit/ From the first context, **"outpouring of the Holy Spirit"** appears to convey the idea of a dramatic, identifiable event, one that might even be highlighted on a calendar. From the second context, **"filling of the Holy Spirit"** seems to describe a more ordinary, ongoing condition that Christians are encouraged to pursue daily. Is this distinction commonly understood among Christians? What is an overview of how major Christian theologies generally understand the concepts of the **"outpouring of the Holy Spirit"** and the **"filling of the Holy Spirit"**?
user117426 (754 rep)
Jan 17, 2026, 03:38 PM • Last activity: Jan 18, 2026, 01:32 PM
4 votes
1 answers
149 views
Which denominations/churches teach the concept of "paying the price", and what biblical passages do they use to support this idea?
Below are several excerpts from Christian websites that discuss the idea of "paying the price" in a spiritual context: > In this sermon, the speaker shares a powerful testimony of a meeting where the glory of God was experienced. It started with one person praying and soon others joined, resulting i...
Below are several excerpts from Christian websites that discuss the idea of "paying the price" in a spiritual context: > In this sermon, the speaker shares a powerful testimony of a meeting where the glory of God was experienced. It started with one person praying and soon others joined, resulting in a powerful outpouring of the Holy Spirit. The meeting lasted for over four hours, with people confessing their sins and seeking God's presence. The speaker emphasizes the need for the glory of God to return to our churches and lives, and encourages repentance, prayer, faith, and identification with Christ **as the simple yet costly price to pay for experiencing God's glory**. > > https://www.sermonindex.net/sermons/XuEeri0s1gBZfmHq > God is a God of process. The major problem with this generation is that men are not ready to **pay the price** to have spiritual power and experiences. But the truth is, if it is genuine, there will be **a price attached to it**. Jesus told the disciples in Luke 24:49 to tarry in Jerusalem until they were endued with power from on high. So, where did you get the version of your divine power without divine process? **Anything valuable always has a price tag**. If you see anything that is valuable, that is cheap, it is either somebody paid for it, or it is stolen. **Authentic power has a price tag**. > > There is a **price you will have to pay** to walk in the authentic power of God. If you see a man that works in supposed power and you don’t see a price in his life, it’s false power he’s working with. The man that God will work with must **pay the price** for spiritual experiences. Specific callings and specific anointing call for specific **prices that we must constantly be paying**. May the Lord find you dependable to carry His power these last days. > > https://spiritmeat.net/2024/06/22/22-june-2024-the-price-for-spiritual-power-and-spiritual-experiences-pay-it-mark-314/ > Every day we need to be watchful by **paying the price to buy the Spirit as the golden oil** so that we may supply the churches with the Spirit for the testimony of Jesus and be rewarded by the Lord to participate in the marriage dinner of the Lamb. > > Our urgent need today is to gain more of the Spirit; we need to live a life of **buying** an extra portion of the Spirit to saturate our entire being. > > Day by day we need to live such a life, a life of **paying the price** to gain the Spirit not only in our spirit but also in our soul, being saturated with the Spirit in our vessel. If we have a day when we don’t **pay the price** to gain the saturating Spirit, that is a wasted day; we do not want to have any wasted days! > > For us to gain more of the Spirit in our soul we need to **pay a price**; we need to **pay the price** of giving up the world, dealing with the self, loving the Lord above all things, and counting all things loss for Christ. > > Day by day we need to **pay the price** of losing our soul life and denying the things that we want to do so that we may pray more, even persevere in prayer and watch unto prayer, so that we may gain more of the Spirit. > > If we don’t **pay the price to buy the oil today**, we will have to pay it after we are resurrected; sooner or later, we will have to **pay the price** – so why not today, why not in this age? > > https://agodman.com/paying-price-buy-spirit-oil-vessel-word-prayer/ > The wise virgins told the foolish virgins to go buy their own oil. When the Bible speaks of the oil, it refers to the Holy Spirit. You may ask, “But, how is it possible to buy the Holy Spirit?” > > Jesus is referring to a person having to **pay the price**, which means denying their will, obeying the Word of God, being faithful, sacrificing and keeping constant watch. > > All those who truly want the presence of God should be aware that **there is a price to pay**. The wise virgins, certainly, **paid the price** (sacrificed) with the time they waited for the bridegroom. Surely, they prepared themselves by investing in their spiritual lives through prayer, fasts, consecration and surrender, not allowing the light of the Spirit to burn out. > > On the other hand, there are those who aren’t willing to **pay that price**. They live according to their fleshly desires, refuse to stop living in sin, are in the church but far from God, have the lamp, which is faith, but don’t have the oil, which is the Holy Spirit. > > https://www.universal.org/en/bispo-macedo/pay-the-price/ Is the idea of "paying the price" for greater spiritual power, anointing, or a deeper experience of God a common teaching across all Christian denominations, or is it emphasized primarily within certain groups? For example, is it widely taught that Christians must *pay a price* to receive more of the Spirit, more anointing, or greater spiritual authority? What is the biblical basis for this teaching?
user117426 (754 rep)
Jul 6, 2025, 03:54 PM • Last activity: Jan 17, 2026, 02:21 PM
4 votes
3 answers
551 views
What is the “something greater than Solomon” in Matthew 12?
To whom or what is Jesus referring in this passage when he speaks of “something greater than Solomon”? > The queen of the South will rise up at the judgment with this > generation and condemn it, for she came from the ends of the earth to > hear the wisdom of Solomon, and behold, something greater t...
To whom or what is Jesus referring in this passage when he speaks of “something greater than Solomon”? > The queen of the South will rise up at the judgment with this > generation and condemn it, for she came from the ends of the earth to > hear the wisdom of Solomon, and behold, something greater than Solomon > is here. (Matthew 12:42, ESV) I have always assumed it was Jesus, but much of Matthew 12 is about the Holy Spirit. Solomon was a wise counselor and the Holy Spirit is the Counselor that Jesus would send. Do any theologians hold that Jesus is speaking of the Holy Spirit and not himself?
Paul Chernoch (15431 rep)
Jan 21, 2023, 12:45 AM • Last activity: Jan 17, 2026, 01:55 AM
9 votes
2 answers
2158 views
How do Cessationists view "being filled with the Holy Spirit"?
I'm aware that [Cessationists][1] do not believe in spiritual gifts. However, how do they view the process of being filled with the Holy Spirit? Tozer's [How to be filled with the holy spirit][2] defines the process as a very dramatic, sudden process. Do Cessationists also take this view, or do they...
I'm aware that Cessationists do not believe in spiritual gifts. However, how do they view the process of being filled with the Holy Spirit? Tozer's How to be filled with the holy spirit defines the process as a very dramatic, sudden process. Do Cessationists also take this view, or do they view it as a more gradual process? ____ #### Appendix - List of verses on "being filled with the Holy Spirit". - And Jesus, **full of the Holy Spirit**, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the wilderness [Luke 4:1, ESV] - 8 But as for me, **I am filled with power, with the Spirit of the Lord**, and with justice and might, to declare to Jacob his transgression and to Israel his sin. [Micah 3:8, ESV] - 18 And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, **but be filled with the Spirit**, [Ephesians 5:18, ESV] - When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place. 2 And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. 3 And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. 4 **And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit** and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance. [Acts 2:1-4, ESV] - 8 Then Peter, **filled with the Holy Spirit**, said to them, “Rulers of the people and elders, [Acts 4:8, ESV] - 31 And when they had prayed, the place in which they were gathered together was shaken, **and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit** and continued to speak the word of God with boldness. [Acts 4:31, ESV] - 3 Therefore, brothers, pick out from among you seven men of good repute, **full of the Spirit** and of wisdom, whom we will appoint to this duty. 4 But we will devote ourselves to prayer and to the ministry of the word.” 5 And what they said pleased the whole gathering, and they chose Stephen, **a man full of faith and of the Holy Spirit**, and Philip, and Prochorus, and Nicanor, and Timon, and Parmenas, and Nicolaus, a proselyte of Antioch. [Acts 6:3-5, ESV] - 54 Now when they heard these things they were enraged, and they ground their teeth at him. 55 But he, **full of the Holy Spirit**, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. [Acts 7:54, ESV] - 17 So Ananias departed and entered the house. And laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus who appeared to you on the road by which you came has sent me so that you may regain your sight **and be filled with the Holy Spirit**.” [Acts 9:17, ESV] - 24 for he was a good man, **full of the Holy Spirit** and of faith. And a great many people were added to the Lord. [Acts 11:24, ESV] - 9 But Saul, who was also called Paul, **filled with the Holy Spirit**, looked intently at him [Acts 13:9, ESV] - 52 And the disciples were **filled with joy and with the Holy Spirit**. [Acts 13:52, ESV] - 15 for he will be great before the Lord. And he must not drink wine or strong drink, **and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit**, even from his mother's womb. [Luke 1:15, ESV] - 67 And his father Zechariah was **filled with the Holy Spirit** and prophesied, saying [Luke 1:67, ESV]
user1694
Aug 14, 2012, 12:15 AM • Last activity: Jan 16, 2026, 10:03 AM
0 votes
2 answers
106 views
Have other group visitations of the Holy Spirit similar to Acts 4:23-31 been reported in church history?
Acts 4:23-31 (ESV): > 23 When they were released, they went to their friends and reported what the chief priests and the elders had said to them. 24 And when they heard it, **they lifted their voices together to God and said**, “Sovereign Lord, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and every...
Acts 4:23-31 (ESV): > 23 When they were released, they went to their friends and reported what the chief priests and the elders had said to them. 24 And when they heard it, **they lifted their voices together to God and said**, “Sovereign Lord, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and everything in them, 25 who through the mouth of our father David, your servant, said by the Holy Spirit, > > “‘Why did the Gentiles rage, > and the peoples plot in vain? > 26 The kings of the earth set themselves, > and the rulers were gathered together, > against the Lord and against his Anointed’— > > 27 for truly in this city there were gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, along with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, 28 to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place. 29 **And now, Lord, look upon their threats and grant to your servants to continue to speak your word with all boldness**, 30 **while you stretch out your hand to heal, and signs and wonders are performed through the name of your holy servant Jesus.”** 31 **And when they had prayed, the place in which they were gathered together was shaken, and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and continued to speak the word of God with boldness**. This is an account of a powerful visitation of the Holy Spirit to the early church in response to fervent communal prayer. And what was the outcome? Extraordinary power and boldness for preaching and witnessing -- exactly what the church needs to carry out the great commission. With such a powerful divine assistance at the church's disposal, it would seem very strange to me if Acts 4:23-31 were an isolated case. **Question**: Have other group visitations of the Holy Spirit similar to Acts 4:23-31 been reported in church history? If so, what was the aftermath of said visitations? Did revival follow as a result?
user50422
Mar 9, 2022, 01:36 AM • Last activity: Nov 13, 2025, 11:19 PM
3 votes
3 answers
122 views
How To Read the 17 Books of Prophecy
Most Christians and leaders seem to quote inspirational verses out of the prophetic books consistently. The issue is that they are taking lots of verses out of context. Recently, I've been wondering how we correctly read the 17 prophetic books. These books seem to only be written for 1. the people a...
Most Christians and leaders seem to quote inspirational verses out of the prophetic books consistently. The issue is that they are taking lots of verses out of context. Recently, I've been wondering how we correctly read the 17 prophetic books. These books seem to only be written for 1. the people at the time 2. descriptions of the Messiah 3. descriptions of The New Heaven and New Earth Outside of this, I have also seen that these prophecies include 1. Double References (Isaiah 14 talking about Satan and a king) 2. Insight into God's Creation (Jeremiah 4) [the Book of Job also does this, but that would of course be poetry and not prophecy] 3. Showing the character and demonstrations of God But what exactly does someone do when they want to read through the Book of Ezekiel or any other book? I have oftentimes been led of the Holy Spirit to see new things in the Prophetic Books, but for the most part, if I have to be honest, it seems like the entire Body of Christ just steers away from these books because of the level of confusion that comes from reading them. Why are they in the Bible? What do they do for New Testament Believers? How does it bring us into the full stature of Christ (2 Timothy 3:16-17)? I understand that there is historical evidence for the prophecies and that we can see what makes God angry, but there has got to be more reasoning behind having 17 books written in this style than just those things. What should I be able to pick up from these books that is beyond what my eyes can see? I cannot find a single answer online, so please know that I did my research before posting here. Thank you.
Joshua Shakir (31 rep)
Nov 11, 2025, 10:42 PM • Last activity: Nov 13, 2025, 11:37 AM
5 votes
2 answers
1347 views
According to Jehovah's Witnesses, who or what is the Holy Spirit?
Traditional Christianity teaches that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three distinct persons, coequal, coeternal, of the same substance, and all fully divine. The Holy Spirit is the same being referred to in the New Testament as the God's Spirit (e.g., 1 Corinthians 2:11, Ephesians 4:30) and as...
Traditional Christianity teaches that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are three distinct persons, coequal, coeternal, of the same substance, and all fully divine. The Holy Spirit is the same being referred to in the New Testament as the God's Spirit (e.g., 1 Corinthians 2:11, Ephesians 4:30) and as Christ's Spirit (e.g., Galatians 4:6, Philippians 1:19, 1 Peter 1:11), and in one place with both titles (Romans 8:9). My understanding of the Jehovah's Witnesses is that they believe God the Father to be fully divine and eternal, but Jesus Christ is his first creation, gifted with semi-divinity. What do they teach about the Holy Spirit? A good answer will address, directly or by clear implication, whether or not the Holy Spirit is: - eternal - eternally/ontologically distinct from God the Father - ontologically divine - a person - one and the same as the Spirit of Christ A good answer will address anything else that a standard JW articulation of the doctrine of the Holy Spirit would address and will use Watchtower sources.
Mr. Bultitude (15725 rep)
Jun 7, 2025, 10:31 PM • Last activity: Oct 27, 2025, 01:52 PM
4 votes
3 answers
3537 views
What does it mean to be "in the Spirit"?
I keep coming upon the phrase **"in the Spirit"** in the NT. One search result of that phrase is here: https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=%22in+the+spirit%22&t=NKJV#s=s_primary_0_1 A few examples are (NKJV): - Acts 19:21, **"Paul purposed in the Spirit"** - Romans 2:29, **"ci...
I keep coming upon the phrase **"in the Spirit"** in the NT. One search result of that phrase is here: https://www.blueletterbible.org/search/search.cfm?Criteria=%22in+the+spirit%22&t=NKJV#s=s_primary_0_1 A few examples are (NKJV): - Acts 19:21, **"Paul purposed in the Spirit"** - Romans 2:29, **"circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter"** - Romans 8:9, **"But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit"** - Galatians 5:16, **"I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh"** It's possible that the phrase has different shades of meaning depending on the verse context. How are we to understand this phrase in a believer's life? I am asking for an answer from the Christian community that conforms to the Nicene Creed of 381 AD. A Pentecostal/charismatic viewpoint is welcome. Also, the tenor of some of these verses indicate that one is in the Spirit or in the flesh, so answers which adhere to this duality are preferred (answers that reflect grace under law to Christ rather than adherence to OT laws for righteousness).
Steve (7756 rep)
Feb 28, 2022, 02:54 PM • Last activity: Sep 30, 2025, 08:05 AM
4 votes
1 answers
135 views
What is an overview of Protestant interpretations of Paul's command to be filled with the Spirit in Ephesians 5:18-21?
The passage reads: > [Ephesians 5:18-21 NASB] 18 And do not get drunk with wine, in which there is debauchery, **but be filled with the Spirit**, 19 speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody with your hearts to the Lord; 20 always giving thanks for al...
The passage reads: > [Ephesians 5:18-21 NASB] 18 And do not get drunk with wine, in which there is debauchery, **but be filled with the Spirit**, 19 speaking to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody with your hearts to the Lord; 20 always giving thanks for all things in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ to our God and Father; 21 and subject yourselves to one another in the fear of Christ. My modern-day interpretation of verse 18, *“And do not get drunk with wine, in which there is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,”* would be this: Instead of chasing a dopamine rush or neurochemical high through alcohol, drugs, opioids, or any other addictive behavior (whether food, sex, pornography, gambling, or the like), seek to be filled with the Spirit. The one who is filled with the Spirit experiences a holy satisfaction that immeasurably surpasses alcohol, drugs, food, sex, psychedelics, or any combination of fleshly indulgences. In other words, I see Ephesians 5:18-21 as a spiritually challenging passage because it seems to urge the Christian to pursue a deep, Spirit-filled state, a profound transformation of affections and emotions that far exceeds any earthly intoxication. I personally picture this spiritual state as vastly superior to the strongest dopamine-driven highs of substances such as alcohol, cocaine, ecstasy, methamphetamines, or any other stimulant the world offers. Furthermore, in verses 19-21 the apostle sets forth several practices. What is not immediately clear, however, is whether these should be understood as *manifestations* (that is, consequences) of being filled with the Spirit, or rather as *means* (that is, practices that foster or open the way toward being filled). With this in mind, I am seeking an **overview of Protestant interpretations** of Ephesians 5:18-21 concerning the lived Christian experience of being filled with the Spirit. In particular, I am asking: - How do Protestants compare the experience of being filled with the Spirit to indulgence in alcohol, drugs, or other dopamine-releasing behaviors? - How do Protestants understand and seek to obey Paul’s command to be filled with the Spirit? ----------- NOTE. You can read parallel commentaries by Biblical scholars on Ephesians 5:18 here: https://biblehub.com/commentaries/ephesians/5-18.htm
user117426 (754 rep)
Sep 17, 2025, 03:25 PM • Last activity: Sep 26, 2025, 12:39 PM
3 votes
2 answers
1719 views
According to Latter Day Saints, how did the Gift of the Holy Ghost operate before Christ came?
How did the Gift of the Holy Ghost operate before Christ came? In particular, I'm wondering how it operated among the ancient Jewish people, who only had the Aaronic priesthood, and therefore would not be able to give the gift of the holy ghost.
How did the Gift of the Holy Ghost operate before Christ came? In particular, I'm wondering how it operated among the ancient Jewish people, who only had the Aaronic priesthood, and therefore would not be able to give the gift of the holy ghost.
Christopher King (1223 rep)
May 12, 2018, 08:07 PM • Last activity: Sep 25, 2025, 02:21 PM
-1 votes
3 answers
182 views
How do non-denominational Christians reconcile their stance with the fellowship of the Holy Spirit?
Some Christians identify as non-denominational and intentionally avoid affiliating with a specific church tradition or denomination. At the same time, Scripture speaks of the “fellowship of the Holy Spirit” (e.g., 2 Corinthians 13:14) and the unity of believers in Christ. How do non-denominational C...
Some Christians identify as non-denominational and intentionally avoid affiliating with a specific church tradition or denomination. At the same time, Scripture speaks of the “fellowship of the Holy Spirit” (e.g., 2 Corinthians 13:14) and the unity of believers in Christ. How do non-denominational Christians understand and live out this fellowship of the Holy Spirit, given their rejection of denominational structures? Do they view fellowship as primarily spiritual and individual, or do they still see it as expressed in organized gatherings with other believers? I am particularly interested in perspectives from those who identify as non-denominational or have studied their theological approach.
Leave The World Behind (5413 rep)
Sep 21, 2025, 08:29 AM • Last activity: Sep 22, 2025, 04:12 PM
-2 votes
2 answers
238 views
According to Baptists, are Christians who have experienced the manifestation of a spiritual gift through the Holy Spirit guaranteed to see God?
Many Christians experience the manifestation of the Holy Spirit through spiritual gifts such as prophecy, tongues, healing, or teaching (cf. 1 Corinthians 12). My question is: If a believer has clearly received and exercised a gift of the Holy Spirit, does this mean they are assured of inheriting et...
Many Christians experience the manifestation of the Holy Spirit through spiritual gifts such as prophecy, tongues, healing, or teaching (cf. 1 Corinthians 12). My question is: If a believer has clearly received and exercised a gift of the Holy Spirit, does this mean they are assured of inheriting eternal life? Or is it still possible for someone to fall away despite having once been used by the Spirit in this way (cf. Matthew 7:21–23, Hebrews 6:4–6)? I am seeking answers from a Christian theological perspective, preferably with biblical support.
Leave The World Behind (5413 rep)
Sep 15, 2025, 07:24 AM • Last activity: Sep 18, 2025, 06:27 PM
2 votes
2 answers
167 views
Is there a specific term to denote an encounter with the Holy Spirit?
Encounters with God (the Father) are called *Theophanies*, encounters with Jesus are called *Christophanies*, but what about encounters with the Holy Spirit? Is there a specific term for an encounter with the third person of the Trinity? **Note**: by encounter, I mean any sort of self-authenticating...
Encounters with God (the Father) are called *Theophanies*, encounters with Jesus are called *Christophanies*, but what about encounters with the Holy Spirit? Is there a specific term for an encounter with the third person of the Trinity? **Note**: by encounter, I mean any sort of self-authenticating experience through which a supernatural being makes its existence or presence known, obvious and clear (i.e. reveals itself) to a person. _____ Related: https://christianity.stackexchange.com/q/86291/50422
user50422
Oct 28, 2021, 10:19 AM • Last activity: Sep 10, 2025, 01:01 PM
0 votes
2 answers
198 views
Did the Holy Spirit move into Jesus during and after His baptism for the first time?
The Gospels record that at Jesus’ baptism, the Holy Spirit descended on Him like a dove (Matthew 3:16, Mark 1:10, Luke 3:22, John 1:32). Immediately afterward, we read that the Spirit led Him into the wilderness to be tempted (Matthew 4:1, Mark 1:12, Luke 4:1). Does this mean that the Holy Spirit en...
The Gospels record that at Jesus’ baptism, the Holy Spirit descended on Him like a dove (Matthew 3:16, Mark 1:10, Luke 3:22, John 1:32). Immediately afterward, we read that the Spirit led Him into the wilderness to be tempted (Matthew 4:1, Mark 1:12, Luke 4:1). Does this mean that the Holy Spirit entered or moved into Jesus only at His baptism, and then guided Him into the wilderness? Or should the descent of the Spirit be understood differently, since Luke 1:35 indicates that Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit and therefore already had a unique relationship with Him before baptism?
Leave The World Behind (5413 rep)
Sep 5, 2025, 01:59 PM • Last activity: Sep 7, 2025, 08:19 AM
1 votes
5 answers
182 views
Did God will for the Spirit and the flesh to be in opposition from the beginning?
Galatians 5:17 says, *"For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh."* This seems to suggest a deliberate opposition between the two. My question is: Was this opposition between the Spirit and the flesh part of God's original design from the begi...
Galatians 5:17 says, *"For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh."* This seems to suggest a deliberate opposition between the two. My question is: Was this opposition between the Spirit and the flesh part of God's original design from the beginning (before the Fall), or did it come about as a result of sin? In other words, did God will for this tension to exist under His authority, or is it a result of rebellion against that authority? I’m looking for answers from perspectives that explain how this dynamic fits into Christian theology — particularly with reference to Scripture and doctrinal traditions.
Leave The World Behind (5413 rep)
Jul 25, 2025, 12:24 PM • Last activity: Aug 7, 2025, 10:22 PM
8 votes
4 answers
8525 views
What is the biblical basis for praying to the Holy Spirit?
There is a [question about praying to Jesus](https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/62358/what-is-the-biblical-basis-for-praying-to-jesus-as-opposed-to-praying-to-god-in) already, but I noticed there is no question about praying to the Holy Spirit. What is the biblical basis for praying to...
There is a [question about praying to Jesus](https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/62358/what-is-the-biblical-basis-for-praying-to-jesus-as-opposed-to-praying-to-god-in) already, but I noticed there is no question about praying to the Holy Spirit. What is the biblical basis for praying to the third person of the trinity?
user50422
Feb 8, 2021, 01:14 AM • Last activity: Aug 3, 2025, 02:48 AM
3 votes
4 answers
639 views
Do Christians who view homosexuality as a sin believe that homosexuals can be freed from their sinful condition by the power of God?
It should be common sense knowledge that many Christians condemn homosexuality as a sin. The following already asked questions should be more than enough to prove the point: - [Why do some Christians believe it is moral to be a homosexual?](https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/381/why-do...
It should be common sense knowledge that many Christians condemn homosexuality as a sin. The following already asked questions should be more than enough to prove the point: - [Why do some Christians believe it is moral to be a homosexual?](https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/381/why-do-some-christians-believe-it-is-moral-to-be-a-homosexual) - [What is the Biblical argument that homosexual attraction is sinful by itself?](https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/35233/what-is-the-biblical-argument-that-homosexual-attraction-is-sinful-by-itself) - [What is a Christian's justification for a legal prohibition of homosexual marriage?](https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/7598/what-is-a-christians-justification-for-a-legal-prohibition-of-homosexual-marria) That said, I'm not sure if I've ever heard Christians who claim that homosexuality is a sin also claim that homosexuals can be freed from their (claimed) sinful condition. Logic tells me that they should expect this to be the case, in light of passages such as: Romans 8:12-17 (ESV): > 12 So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die, **but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live**. 14 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15 For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17 and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him. Galatians 5:16-24 (ESV): > 16 But I say, **walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh**. 17 For the desires of the flesh are against the Spirit, and the desires of the Spirit are against the flesh, for these are opposed to each other, to keep you from doing the things you want to do. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. 19 **Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality**, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 **But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness**, 23 **gentleness, self-control**; against such things there is no law. 24 **And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires**. If homosexuality is a sinful desire of the flesh, as many Christians believe, does this mean that homosexuality, as any other sin, can be reversed by the power of God, through the Holy Spirit, as the passages above seem to indicate? Is this the standard view among Christians who condemn homosexuality as a sin? An alternative way of phrasing the question: Can God heal homosexuality (according to those who view homosexuality as a sin)?
user50422
Apr 27, 2021, 11:38 AM • Last activity: Jul 26, 2025, 04:19 PM
0 votes
0 answers
81 views
According to followers of the Unity Church, is the Holy Spirit seen as feminine because of being called a helper like Eve?
Unity Church often [refers][1] to the Holy Spirit in feminine terms, a view that contrasts with traditional Christian doctrine. This raises the question of whether their belief is tied to certain biblical wordings. In Genesis 2:18 (ESV), Eve is introduced with: > “Then the Lord God said, ‘It is not...
Unity Church often refers to the Holy Spirit in feminine terms, a view that contrasts with traditional Christian doctrine. This raises the question of whether their belief is tied to certain biblical wordings. In Genesis 2:18 (ESV), Eve is introduced with: > “Then the Lord God said, ‘It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.’” In the Gospel of John, the Holy Spirit is called a helper multiple times. For example, John 14:16 (ESV) says: > “And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever.” Other similar references include John 14:26, 15:26, and 16:7, all using the Greek term paraklētos (translated as Helper, Comforter, or Advocate). Is Unity Church’s feminine understanding of the Holy Spirit based on this shared role/title of “helper” between Eve and the Spirit? Or is their interpretation shaped more by metaphysical symbolism or other theological influences?
Leave The World Behind (5413 rep)
Jun 26, 2025, 02:44 PM • Last activity: Jul 25, 2025, 11:06 PM
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